Past, Present, and Future
December 31, 1999 was not just any other New Year’s Eve. The new millennium was upon us and the world was preparing for the chaos that might spread across the globe when the clock stuck midnight. That moment when computers might not recognize the year 2000 and cause all kinds of glitches from minor annoyances to serious disasters. Y2K might seem like a blip on our historical radar these days, but it was very concerning to anyone with a computer or technology that required one. My hospital was stocked up with extra supplies, emergency flashlights, and bottled water. We were ready for the computers to shut down and rely on doing things the old fashioned way. Thankfully, nothing happened.
Has a quarter of a century already passed by? It’s going to be 2025 already! Time flies and so do these mysterious drones. Maybe they’re just practicing for a big light show on New Year’s Eve, or have been searching for Santa. I don’t know if the technology is of alien origin, an enemy conspiracy, or a flash mob of drone-owning tech guys. Until the truth is revealed I’ll focus on the mysteries that I can actually solve. Those of the genealogy kind.
Only in recent years have genealogists used computer technology as part of our research. It has expanded our access to original documents, allowed sharing of family trees, and for collaboration with cousins across the world in an efficient and timely manner. Family historians who came before us corresponded by paper and pen (or poorly sharpened pencil) conveying stories and tidbits of information that may still be sitting in a dusty chest in your attic, closet, or basement. Don’t overlook that box of family treasures. They may come in the form of research notes, family letters, or old photos. Maybe it’s time to take a look at what you’ve got.
Recent conversations with a few Guthrie descendants have reminded me how easily we fall into the trap of our own technology. We incessantly copy/paste into our trees because it’s the easy way to do it. We overlook the paper files that our relatives compiled because it can be a pain to dig them out, not realizing that they may hold key details that explain the origin of ongoing theories. They may also have amassed a lot of work that you won’t need to repeat. Compiled notes, sources and stories are genealogy gold. If you’ve got some stashed away, make it your New Year’s Resolution to share it.
GUTHRIE GENEALOGY: WEBSITE UPDATES / NEW CONTENT
The Research & Resources tab has been reconfigured and expanded.
- Biographical Sketches – Includes Research/Resources to help clear up some of the confusion about family relations and where the data originated. (Rev. James Guthrie and Rev. William Guthrie)
- Family Focus – A list of all of the Family Focus topics in one place
- Guthrie Hot Topics – Quick links of other Blog topics
- Mistaken Identities – The ongoing list of Mistaken Identity Issues
- Notable Families (See Below)
- Recommended Reading – Books about and/or written by Guthries
- GU3 by Location – Research or Links gathered for specific locations
- Revolutionary War Series – Guthries in the American Revolution
Notable Families: The History and Genealogy of some Notable Guthrie Families
From the Guthrie Genealogy home page > Reading and Resources > Notable Families to reach the list:
Guthrie of Kingennie & Pitforthie
Feel free to suggest more notable families or contribute more sources or reading recommendations.
MAJOR LINEAGE UPDATES
The Guthries of Pitforthie now includes several generations of ancestors who lived in Kingennie, a village in Angus about 2 miles north of Monifieth. The latter dates back to the 9th century and remained a small village until the start of the 19th century. The Kingennie story includes a fortification or castle that was once called ‘Castle Guthrough’ by the locals that has now completely disappeared into the surrounding landscape. Read the Notable Families story ‘Guthrie of Kingennie & Pitforthie‘ for the details. The Guthries of Pitforthie are not officially assigned to any specific Guthrie Family Group, although they have been claimed by one branch of GFG2A as their ancestral origin story.
GFG5 – Branch G: Henry Guthrie (1812GA-1855GA) and Manerva Lyon (1813GA-1896AL)
This family has previously not been connected (to my knowledge) with an origin story or Guthrie ancestors. We have known about the Guthrie Family Group 5 connection for some time, but now have a solid lead on Henry’s parents and how he links up to the main branch of the group. Read the new Origin Theories for GFG5-Branch G.
GFG14 – Branch A: George Nelson Guthrie & Unidentified Spouse
Not certain that this qualifies as a ‘major lineage update’, but it may be news to those of you who descend from George Nelson Guthrie. This family has frequently been caught up in a case of Mistaken Identity. Descendants are not genetically related to any of the major Guthrie Family Groups, but form their own group of Guthries that match the genetic profile of men from the Joyce/Joice surname. An adoption or non-paternal event is a likely cause. The difficulty in identifying the original family to which George Nelson Guthrie belonged has primarily been a lack of documentation, or even discovering where his family story came from in the first place. An old Genealogy.com site included excerpts from ‘The Early History of the Guthrie Family‘ written by Henry F Guthrie in 1946. Henry Franklin Guthrie (1856-1949) was the grandson of Richard Guthrie and Mary VanScoyoc making him a great-grandson of George Nelson Guthrie. The excerpts include the name George Nelson Guthrie, his family’s arrival in New Jersey, and the story of George Nelson Guthrie and his brothers during the American Revolution. Reviewing online information about Henry Franklin Guthrie shows that he was a family historian involved in family history societies writing and speaking about his ancestors. Tracking down a copy of the pamphlet (or original document) could help clarify George Nelson Guthrie’s family origins. There may be a copy of his pamphlet at one of the Ohio historical societies or archives. It could potentially have been published as a chapter in one of the Ohio historical society magazines. If anyone has access or a contact please try to track down this source.
GFG2A – Branch K: Robert Guttery (1752SC-1799GA)/Elizabeth ‘Betsy’ MNU
The youngest daughter, previously documented as “Molly Guttery” is actually nicknamed “Milly” which is short for Pemely (or possibly the standard spellings Permelia / Permilia). She married James Young on 5 Feb 1821 in Hall County, Georgia. See ‘Pemelia ‘Milly’ Guttery’ (Guthrie Research Tree) or (Guthrie Genealogy Family Page)
CONTINUING GROUP by GROUP WEBSITE EXPANSION
Guthrie Family Group 5A currently has 8 branches A thru H. Having just finished the Branch G section on Henry Guthrie and Manerva Lyon’s family lines, the final branch of the group is up for review. Branch H is the family of Thomas Guthrie and Mildred Howell. This family was once believed to be a part of Guthrie Family Group 2A, as was theorized by ‘American Guthrie and Allied Families‘ author, Lawrence R. Guthrie. He linked this Thomas Guthrie to a record from Pennsylvania, which may have led him to conclude that he was part of one of the sons of James Guthrie and Miss Bissell from GFG2A-Branch I. DNA proves that was the wrong conclusion. Was this Thomas Guthrie ever in Pennsylvania, or was he actually in Virginia during the early years of his life? He was living in Fauquier County, Virginia in 1792 and moved to Woodford County, Kentucky about 1797. Let’s find some new clues!
THE GUTHRIE DNA PROJECT
The current count is 989 members at FTDNA, plus dozens more unique members at Ancestry DNA. The project continues to be active. There is usually a bump of new members at the close of the holiday DNA test sales, so hopefully we’ll see some new lineages represented this year. Reminders that there are frequent sales events across all of the companies.
Y-DNA and Big-Y tests examine the Direct Paternal Line. – Conclusive evidence for family grouping / origins. Testers must be Guthrie men or those who biologically match a Guthrie YDNA profile
Start with a Y-37 or Y-111 marker test. Consider upgrading to Big-Y 700 if recommended based on your results.
Y-37 should achieve a group match if it exists.
Y-111 allows a more detailed comparison with your group, sometimes showing inherited familial markers.
The Big-Y test reveals very distant branching within the group and beyond to the distant parts of your human family tree.
Autosomal DNA Testing:
FTDNA’s Family Ancestry test or the Ancestry DNA can be reviewed directly.
Tests at MyHeritage or 23andMe can be transferred for free using FTDNA’s ‘Upload DNA Data’ link.
Testers may be men or women of Guthrie ancestry.
New Member Lineages:
Anslem Guthrie (1796VA-1879IL)/Matilda Brock > James Brock Guthrie/Susan Catherine Owens > Alice A Guthrie/William Frank Pearson… (3 new participants) – This line is in an Ungrouped Family Status. Autosomal DNA tester. Need Y-DNA representation for the Guthrie-Brock line. Mistaken Identity Warning: Do not confuse this Anslem Guthrie with Dr Anslem Guthrie (b.1785-90NY) as some trees merge their family data..
George Nelson Guthrie/Unk Spouse > Richard Guthrie (1777NY-1851OH)/Mary VanScoyoc > Stephen Guthrie/ Kezia Wellington > Levi Guthrie/Sarah Ann Zongker > Jacob Martin Guthrie/Maude McCarty (GGP). This family is part of GFG14 – Branch A. Autosomal DNA tester.
John Guthrie (c1730SCT – 1815SCT)/Susan Fisken > Susan Guthrie/David Hutton > David Hutton/Barbara Mary Hilton > Mary Barbara Hutton/Henry Pavy (GGP). This line is from Tibbermore, Perthshire, Scotland. Theorized parents of John are John Guthrie (c1694-1789) and Jean Gib from Tibbermore. Ungrouped Family Status with two Autosomal DNA testers
Family of 3 with surname ‘Short’ has Big-Y matches to Guthrie men, but the Most Recent Common Ancestor is from 50 C.E.
James Guthrie (1828-1910IRE) / Anne Jane Kilpatrick > William Guthrie / Ellen Montgomery (GGP)
Y-111 test pending.
Two Guthrie ancestral lineages from genetically unrelated groups:
Paternal Ancestors: GFG2A – Branch K: Robert Guttery (1752SC-1799GA)/Elizabeth MNU > Permelia Guttery/James Young > Zachariah Young/Mary A Coley > John W Young/Mary Elizabeth Garrett > James Watson Young/Sarah Moss (GGP)
Maternal Ancestors: GFG1A – Branch B: John Guthrie (d.1706VA)/Elizabeth Baskett > John Guthrie/Mary Shay > Garritt Guthrie/Unk Spouse > James Guthrie/Nancy Garrett > Mary ‘Polly’ Guthrie/Nathaniel Teagle > Elizabeth Teagle/Phillip Jenkins > Leroy N Jenkins/Emeline Goodroe > John Thomas Jenkins/Maggie Ophelia Kay > Jack Thomas Jenkins/Mary Francis Layton (GGP)
Autosomal DNA tester.
Two GFG4 lines both descend from GFG4 Ancestors and merge again:
Thomas Guthrey (c1717VA-1800VA)/Sarah Oakes > Travis Guthrey/Mary Ann Hill > William T Guthrey/Nancy Davis > William C Guthrie / Margaret P Crews*
– and –
Thomas Guthrey (c1717VA-1800VA)/Sarah Oakes > John Guthrey/Betty Ann Allen > Sally King Guthrey/Richard Crews > Margaret P Crews / William C Guthrie* > William J Guthrie/Eliza Ann Francis > Leslie T Guthrie/Lyda Williams Mason (GGP)
Y-DNA Test pending.
William Guthrie (1837 Tipperary, IRE-bef.1900) / Margaret Bergen > Thomas Guthrie/ Mary Mulcahy (GGP)
Thomas was born in Caher, Tipperary, Ireland in 1865 and immigrated to New Jersey where he died in 1902.
Autosomal DNA test.
THE LATEST on the BIG-Y TESTS
Sign into FTDNA for the latest Group Time Tree results for your Guthrie Family Group.
GFG2A Update:
A minor update for this group as a Big-Y result comes in with expected results.
This is the largest of all family groups with Branches A thru O machine its Y-DNA profile.
Big-Y testers represent Branches A, B, C, and D.
Branch A is known to be most closely related to Branches E and H due to familial markers at the Y111 level.
Branch B is part of the ‘Three Brothers Origin Story” along with Branches F and I.
Branch C has not been identified as being closer to one branch versus the others…. until now.
Branch D has not been identified as being closer to one branch versus the others… until now.
We need some Big-Y representation from Branches E, F, G, H, I, J, K, L, M and O to help pinpoint where they diverge from the rest of the group.
Current testing shows that Branches C and D share a more recent common ancestor than they do with the rest of the group. They also share a more recent common ancestor with Branch B than they do with Branch A.
GFG8 Update
Two close relatives descending from GFG8 – Branch D’s Carter Guthrie and Barbara Beal have added their tests to the GFG8 Group Time Tree for comparison against GFG8 – Branch A’s Thomas Guthrie and Mary Cason.
The Group Time Tree predicts the Most Recent Common Ancestor (MRCA) between the two branches as being born about 1661. The technology also predicts that the descendants of Carter Guthrie actually share a common ancestor who was born about 1861. Their actual MRCA was born in 1911, but that man’s father was born in 1868. The estimates appear close +/- a generation.
MEASUREMENTS of TIME
Have you noticed years are no longer listed as BC and AD? Instead it’s BCE and CE, at least in scientific reports?
I finally got around to a little self education on this matter and thought I would share.
Those of you (like me) who have been around for a while are used to calendar notations of “B.C.” and “A.D.” to notate time periods “Before Christ” and “Anno Domini”. The latter in Latin means ‘In the year of the Lord,’ not ‘After Death’.
If you have not been a student recently, you might have missed the new designations for these eras or been confused about what the abbreviations “C.E.” and “B.C.E” after a year actually mean.
Pope Dionysius of Alexandria, was a bishop of Rome from 22 July 259 A.D. to his death on 26 December 268 A.D. He first changed the system of dating years from the Roman and Alexandrian system to his own in which the relatively new Christian era dated from the birth of Jesus of Nazareth.
Current day scholars now opt for a secular (non-religious) method of identifying years, although the dates themselves are numerically equivalent. The year 259 A.D. is the same as the year 259 C.E. while 10,000 B.C. is the same as 10,000 B.C.E.
“B.C.” = “B.C.E.” meaning “Before the Common Era”
“A.D” = “C.E.” meaning “Common Era”
Wishing you all the best for a safe, happy, and hopeful New Year.
May it be full of genealogical discoveries.
My mum was a Guthrie from Dundee, Scotland and I would love to know how to go about doing a DNA test. I have done the Ancestry one.
All you need to do is send an Ancestry invitation to my email anngu3@icloud.com. Go to your settings to DNA sharing. Select my role as ‘viewer’. Also send me your lineage starting with you and going back to your earliest proven Guthrie ancestor.