A: James Guthrie & Christian Scott
Guthrie Family Group 1A · Branch A
James Guthrie & Christian Scott
Dundee, Angus, Scotland
View this family in the Guthrie Research Tree
James Guthrie and Christian Scott’s family connects Dundee’s merchants and ministers with the later Guthries of Craigie and Taybank. Meet their nine children, explore the records that name their relatives, and follow the questions still shaping this family’s story.
Find your family. Follow their story.
The Family at a Glance
James Guthrie
Dundee, Angus, Scotland
- Parents
- Rev. John Guthrie & Isobel Lamb
- Birth
- About 1663
- Death
- 1 April 1710
- Occupation
- Merchant of Dundee
Christian Scott
Dundee, Angus, Scotland
- Parents
- John Scot, merchant of Dundee,
& Christian Watson - Birth
- 29 November 1669, Dundee
- Death
- Unknown; living 6 January 1724
- Occupation / Household Role
- Merchant’s wife
James Guthrie and Christian Scott married in Dundee in 1695. Their family included one daughter and eight sons. James came from a family of ministers, while Christian was the daughter of a Dundee merchant. Their sons James and Alexander became the forebears of the later Craigie and Taybank lines.
Christian outlived James and appears as grandmother in the 1724 baptism of her namesake granddaughter, a child of John Guthrie and Ann Dempster. Her death date and the later lives of several of their children remain unresolved.
Explore the Next Generation
Select a child’s name to follow their story.
| Child & Family Page | Baptism | Marriage & Later Life |
|---|---|---|
| Issobell Guthrie | 30 December 1695 | Her later life and any marriage remain unresolved. |
| John Guthrie | 14 January 1697 | Married Ann Dempster in 1722. Living 1 May 1774, according to the Guthrie Research Tree transcription of his grandson’s baptism. Death date unknown. |
| James Guthrie | 30 March 1698 | Married Elizabeth Gardyne. This is the line of the Guthries of Craigie. |
| Robert Guthrie | 8 June 1699 | Married Jean Fowler on 3 August 1726. A Dundee merchant; conflicting maternal names in two children’s baptisms remain a research question. |
| Thomas Guthrie | 10 October 1700 | The Guthrie Research Tree reports that he died unmarried. His death date is unknown. |
| William Guthrie | 22 April 1702 | The Guthrie Research Tree reports that he died unmarried. His death date is unknown. |
| Patrick Guthrie | 5 October 1704 | His identification with the Patrick Guthrie who married Agnes Foord on 3 June 1726 remains provisional. |
| Hendri Guthrie | 29 April 1707 | Also called Hendrie or Henry. The Guthrie Research Tree reports that he died unmarried; his death date is unknown. |
| Alexander Guthrie | Not located | Married Elizabeth Moray on 5 December 1738, according to the Guthrie Research Tree. His children’s records establish his parentage. This is the Taybank line; his birth order remains unresolved. |
Family Evidence Notes Open for dates, family connections & unresolved identities
Baptisms & Birth Order
The eight dated entries above are Dundee baptisms, not automatically dates of birth. Alexander’s baptism has not been located, and his position at the end of the table does not assign him a birth order. The Lyon Office record of 17 February 1871 (volume 8, record 91) describes him as the fifth son; that statement remains to be reconciled with the parish evidence.
James & Christian
James’s epitaph provides the basis for the approximate birth year and 1 April 1710 death date shown above. Fasti Ecclesiae Scoticanae, volume 5, pages 319–320, gives differing dates of 20 April 1669 and 1711. Christian’s birth and parents are attributed to Dundee Old Parish Registers in the family profile. Their marriage is shown as 1695 pending reconciliation of conflicting April dates. Christian is named as grandmother in the Dundee baptism of 6 January 1724; this is evidence that she was living then, distinct from later commemorative naming.
John’s Later Life
The Guthrie Research Tree transcription of the baptism of John Guthrie on 1 May 1774 names John Guthrie as grandfather. The child’s parents were John Guthrie, merchant, and Helen Yeaman. This supports the grandfather’s survival to that date; his death remains unlocated.
Robert’s Family
Robert’s marriage to Jean Fowler is dated 3 August 1726. The baptisms of James (11 September 1729) and Clara (26 April 1731) name Ann Fuller; Clara’s entry appears to contain an alteration to the mother’s forename. Other children’s entries name Jean Fowler. These discrepancies do not establish a second marriage, a second partner, or illegitimacy.
Which Patrick Married Agnes Foord?
James and Christian’s son was baptized in Dundee in 1704. Another candidate, a son of Thomas Guthrie, was baptized at Rescobie on 29 August 1700. The Patrick who married Agnes Foord in 1726 was of St Vigeans. Y-DNA connects descendants of Patrick and Agnes with the documented Craigie line, supporting shared paternal ancestry without identifying which childhood family was his. No comparative Y-DNA line from the Rescobie candidate has been established.
Thomas, William & Hendri
The reports that these sons died unmarried come from the Guthrie Research Tree. They do not establish death dates or imply that the sons died young. A possible Henry Guthrie–Elizabeth White marriage remains an unconfirmed lead for Hendri.
Alexander’s Parentage
Although Alexander’s own baptism is unlocated, his children’s records identify James Guthrie, merchant, and Christian Scott as grandparents, and James Guthrie of Craigie as an uncle. These family connections establish his place in the household. References made in commemoration do not establish that a named relative was still living.
Historical Highlights
Dundee Merchants, Ministers & Family Ties
James Guthrie and Christian Scott’s family belonged to Dundee’s intertwined worlds of commerce and the church. James was a merchant and the son of Rev. John Guthrie, Minister of Arbirlot & Dundee, and Isobel Lamb. Christian was the daughter of John Scot, a Dundee merchant, and Christian Watson. Their children’s baptism records reveal further connections to the sea and overseas trade, naming Patrick Scott, a mariner, and Henry Scott, a merchant in London, as uncles.
Two notable landed branches descend from this couple: the Guthries of Craigie through their son James, and the Guthries of Taybank through their son Alexander. The parish records help establish these connections by naming grandparents, uncles, and other relatives. Although Alexander’s own baptism has not been located, his children’s records identify James Guthrie and Christian Scott as grandparents.
Research in our Special Collections sources has overturned the traditional placement of the Eassie and Hiltoun family within the Guthries of Guthrie. The records identify Eassie and Hiltoun as a separate family line. The familiar pedigree joining the later Craigie and Taybank branches to the principal Guthries of Guthrie through Hiltoun should therefore no longer be presented as their established ancestry.
An important source for the Craigie ancestry is the pedigree formally corrected in 1773 by the Lyon Office, Scotland’s heraldic authority. It restores generations omitted from the previous year’s account and traces the family from William Guthrie of Hiltoun and Margaret Ogilvie through St Andrews and the ministerial generations to the Dundee merchant family. Although it repeats a claim of descent from the ancient Guthries of Guthrie, that statement does not establish the traditional connection overturned by the documentary research. The Craigie study compares the original and corrected pedigrees, while the Eassie & Hiltoun study explains the separate family line and the records behind its reconstruction.
The proposed identification of Patrick Guthrie, husband of Agnes Foord, as James and Christian’s son brings together a plausible baptism and a Y-DNA connection. Their son Patrick was baptized in Dundee in 1704, making him about twenty-one at the 1726 marriage, and a male-line descendant of Patrick and Agnes matches the documented Craigie line. A second candidate, however, was baptized in Rescobie in 1700 as a son of Thomas Guthrie. Both were of a suitable age to be Agnes’s husband. The DNA supports shared paternal ancestry, but that connection could lie in an earlier generation and does not by itself distinguish the candidates. A record linking the adult Patrick of St Vigeans to his childhood family would help resolve the question.
The Family Timeline
From a minister’s household and a Stockholm apprenticeship to family life in Dundee, the surviving records trace James and Christian’s story—and the beginnings of the Craigie and Taybank branches.
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About 1663 Approximate birth
James Guthrie Is Born
Scotland · The ministerial family
James was a son of Rev. John Guthrie and Isobel Lamb. His father’s ministry connected the family with Arbirlot and Dundee; James would make his career in commerce.
Open the evidence for James’s dates
James’s memorial gives his age as forty-six at his death in April 1710, suggesting a birth about 1663–1664. The approximate date follows that evidence.
Fasti Ecclesiæ Scoticanæ, volume V, pages 319–320, supplies the competing dates 20 April 1669 and 1711. These remain a source discrepancy rather than interchangeable dates for the timeline.
Sources: James Thomson, The History of Dundee (1874), p. 394; Hew Scott, Fasti Ecclesiæ Scoticanæ, V, pp. 319–320.
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29 November
1669Christian Scott Is Born
Dundee, Angus, Scotland
Christian was the daughter of John Scot, a Dundee merchant, and Christian Watson. Her family’s commercial connections would also appear among the relatives named in her children’s baptism records.
Source: Dundee parish-record information cited in the Guthrie Research Tree.
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Early Life Date unknown
An Apprenticeship in Stockholm
Stockholm, Sweden · Overseas trade
James’s memorial records that his father sent him abroad while he was young. He served a mercantile apprenticeship in Stockholm and, after completing it, traded with many nations.
The account preserves an unusually personal glimpse of his training, although the dates, his master’s name, and the goods he traded remain unknown.
Source: Howff inscription, printed in Thomson, The History of Dundee (1874), p. 394.
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4 April 1684 Will dated
A Will Preserves the Earlier Household
Dundee · Rev. John Guthrie’s family
James’s father made a will that names his eldest son John and eldest daughter Isobell as joint executors. Its provisions for his children preserve family detail beyond the later published pedigrees.
Read the will’s family clues & source
The will refers to the children’s deceased mother and records provisions for the children and the sharing of books. It also distinguishes the minister’s brother, Mr. James Guthrie, from his children.
The testament was recorded on 6 November 1688. That registration date is separate from the date of the will and does not establish an exact death date for Rev. John.
Source: Brechin Commissary Court, CC3/3/7, images 419–421; will dated 4 April 1684, recorded 6 November 1688.
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1695
James Guthrie Marries Christian Scott
Dundee, Angus, Scotland
The marriage brought together James’s ministerial background and Christian’s Dundee merchant family. Their children’s records would reveal a wider circle of merchants, mariners, and relatives.
Source: Dundee Old Parish Register, marriage entry, OPR 282/120/18. The precise April date remains under review.
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1695–1707 Recorded baptisms
A Growing Dundee Family
Dundee · One daughter and eight sons
Eight children appear in the baptismal sequence from Issobell in 1695 to Hendri in 1707. A ninth child, Alexander, is securely connected to James and Christian through the records of his own children, although his baptism has not been located.
The relatives named in these records include Patrick Scott, a mariner, and Henry Scott, a merchant in London—connections extending the family’s story beyond Dundee.
Open the baptism dates & family connections
- Issobell · 30 December 1695
- John · 14 January 1697
- James · 30 March 1698
- Robert · 8 June 1699
- Thomas · 10 October 1700
- William · 22 April 1702
- Patrick · 5 October 1704
- Hendri · 29 April 1707
These are baptism dates, not automatically birth dates. Alexander’s position in the birth order remains unresolved.
The parish entries identify Patrick Scott and Henry Scott as uncles. Such relationship labels help reconstruct the family’s commercial and maritime connections.
Sources: Dundee Old Parish Registers; family transcriptions in the Guthrie Research Tree. Explore the children’s individual family pages ↑
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1 April 1710
James Dies; Christian Commemorates His Life
The Howff, Dundee · Memorial evidence
The inscription records James’s death at forty-six, leaving Christian and seven sons surviving. Christian commissioned the monument at her own expense, preserving the account of his father, apprenticeship, and trading career.
The upper entry preserves James’s memorial. James Thomson, The History of Dundee (1874), p. 394. Select the image to enlarge. Read what the epitaph establishes
The printed rendering gives the death date as the calends of April 1710, meaning 1 April. It names his father as Mr. John Guthrie, a minister in Dundee, and his wife as Christian Scott.
The reference to seven surviving sons does not name them individually. Its omission of a daughter does not, by itself, establish Issobell’s death.
The wording about an upright judge describes a relationship to that person; it does not establish a judicial office for James. The judge and the route of the relationship remain unidentified.
Source: Thomson’s nineteenth-century printed account of the Howff inscription, p. 394.
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1722–1724
Christian Appears as a Grandmother
Dundee · John Guthrie and Ann Dempster’s family
Their son John married Ann Dempster in 1722. At the baptism of the couple’s daughter Christian on 6 January 1724, the register names Christian Scott as grandmother.
This record places Christian within the next generation’s family life nearly fourteen years after James’s death. Her own death date remains unknown.
Source: Dundee Old Parish Register, Christian Guthrie’s baptism, 6 January 1724. Follow John and Ann’s family →
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1726
Marriages in the Next Generation
Dundee and the Angus parishes
Robert Guthrie married Jean Fowler on 3 August 1726. A Dundee merchant, he continued the family’s commercial associations.
A second marriage, between Patrick Guthrie and Agnes Foord on 3 June 1726, may belong to James and Christian’s son Patrick. That identification remains provisional.
Open the Patrick Guthrie identity question
The marriage identifies Patrick with St Vigeans and Agnes with Arbirlot. James and Christian’s son, baptized in Dundee in 1704, is a plausible candidate. Another Patrick was baptized in Rescobie in 1700, a son of Thomas Guthrie.
The Y-DNA connection between descendants of Patrick and Agnes and the documented Craigie line supports shared paternal ancestry. It does not distinguish these candidates or establish James and Christian as Patrick’s parents.
Sources: parish marriage records for Robert Guthrie and Jean Fowler, 3 August 1726, and Patrick Guthrie and Agnes Foord, 3 June 1726.
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1729–1733
The Craigie Branch Takes Shape
Craigie, east of Dundee
A 1729 account concerns the price of Craigie lands sold by James and George Kyd to James Guthrie. It provides a dated property record for the developing Craigie connection in the generation of James and Christian’s son James.
The younger James married Elizabeth Gardyne in 1733. Their descendants continued the Guthrie family associated with Craigie.
Open the Craigie property reference & dating note
The National Records of Scotland catalogue describes an account of the disposal of the purchase price and dates it to 1729. An account date should not automatically be treated as the exact date of purchase.
The reported 1704 reference to a James Guthrie of Craigie remains unresolved. The original council entry is needed before it can be assigned to this family.
Source: NRS GD137/3167, catalogue description, 1729. Read the Craigie study →
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1738–1743
Alexander’s Children Preserve His Parentage
Dundee · Alexander Guthrie and Elizabeth Moray
Alexander, another merchant son of James and Christian, married Elizabeth Moray in 1738. Their children’s baptism entries supply the family relationships missing from Alexander’s unlocated baptism.
Read the grandparents & uncle named in the records
21 July 1740: the baptism of their son James commemorates James Guthrie, merchant, as grandfather and names James Guthrie of Craigie as uncle.
20 December 1743: their daughter Christian’s baptism names Christian Scott as grandmother. A naming reference alone does not establish that the grandmother was still alive on that date.
Together, these relationships establish Alexander’s place in James and Christian’s family and connect his descendants with the Craigie branch.
Sources: Dundee baptismal entries as transcribed in the Guthrie Research Tree. The tree records Alexander and Elizabeth’s marriage as 5 December 1738. Explore Alexander’s family →
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22 August
1748A Grandson in the Taybank Line
Dundee · Charles Guthrie
Charles, son of Alexander Guthrie and Elizabeth Moray, was born on 22 August and baptized on 24 August. He later became the merchant and proprietor associated with Taybank, carrying James and Christian’s family into another named branch.
Source: Dundee parish entry, as transcribed in the Alexander Guthrie family study.
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2 July 1794 The later family
“Charles Guthrie of Tay Bank”
Taybank, Dundee
The male-servant tax names Charles Guthrie of Tay Bank and records a gardener in his service. By this date, the Taybank name was attached to the family descended through Alexander, alongside the Craigie branch descended through his brother James.
Source: Male Servant Tax, E326/5/23, 2 July 1794, cited and discussed in the Taybank study.
The records leave further questions about Christian’s later years and several of the children. Explore the Research brings together the documentary evidence, DNA findings, and questions still to resolve.
Explore the Records
Follow the evidence behind this family’s story: the DNA results, the records that name their relatives, and the questions that could connect another generation.
The Guthrie DNA Project
Y-DNA follows the line from father to son. A documented descendant of the Guthries of Craigie connects James Guthrie and Christian Scott’s family with Guthrie Family Group 1A. A descendant of Patrick Guthrie and Agnes Foord belongs to the same wider paternal family. Whether Agnes’s husband was James and Christian’s son Patrick remains a separate question for the records.
Which Descendant Lines Are Represented?
Select a child’s name to explore that family.
| Child | Y-DNA | Big-Y | Autosomal |
|---|---|---|---|
| Issobell | N/A | N/A | — |
| John | — | — | — |
| JamesCraigie | ✓ | — | — |
| Robert | — | — | — |
| Thomas | — | — | — |
| William | — | — | — |
| PatrickFoord line* | ✓* | ✓* | ✓* |
| Hendri | — | — | — |
| AlexanderTaybank | — | — | — |
✓ = a descendant line is represented. — = no participant is recorded here. N/A = James’s Y-DNA cannot pass through a daughter. “Autosomal” means the type of DNA test that can find relatives through either parent.
*Patrick’s placement: these participants descend from Patrick Guthrie and Agnes Foord. Their inclusion here depends on identifying that Patrick as James and Christian’s son. Recorded autosomal participation includes descendants through Patrick “Peter” Guthrie and his daughter Jane.
Participation does not by itself prove descent from this couple. An empty entry does not mean a child had no descendants. Testing opportunities and kit details appear in the accordions below.
What Have We Learned?
The existing Y-DNA results connect the GFG1A branches through a shared father-to-son ancestry. Family records tell us which ancestors each participant descends from; matching DNA patterns help connect those families. Big-Y examines that paternal DNA in greater detail, adding clues about which lines share a closer ancestor and approximately when he lived.
The Big-Y results linked to identified family lines represent Branches A, B, and G, together with a related Godfrey family:
- Branch A — James Guthrie & Christian Scott of Dundee, Scotland. Big-Y is represented by the proposed Patrick Guthrie–Agnes Foord descendant line. Identifying Patrick as James and Christian’s son remains unconfirmed. The documented Craigie descendant has a standard Y-DNA test, without a Big-Y result.
- Branch B — John Guthrie & Elizabeth Baskett of Middlesex County, Virginia. The Guthrie–Baskett family is represented by two different descendant lines. Their separate paths provide a useful comparison within this branch.
- Branch G — William Guthrie & Elizabeth Wingfield, proposed ancestors. The Big-Y participant descends from John William Guthrie and Elizabeth White. John William’s placement under the Guthrie–Wingfield couple remains a research question.
- The Godfrey family. This participant’s recorded family traces to William Godfrey, born about 1800 in Pennsylvania and later associated with Indiana. His paternal DNA connects him with GFG1A, although the records have not yet revealed how the Godfrey and Guthrie families join.
The shared ancestor connecting these Big-Y-tested lines is currently estimated to have been born around 1421, with uncertainty spanning several centuries. This points toward an earlier family connection, before James Guthrie and Christian Scott’s lifetime. It does not identify the man or place him in a particular Guthrie household. The estimate applies to the men compared; branches without Big-Y results may add to or refine this picture.
The Patrick–Agnes Foord descendant and the Godfrey participant share a closer, more recent paternal ancestor with each other than with the tested Branch B and Branch G men. Their connecting ancestor is estimated to have been born around 1651, again with a wide margin of error. Big-Y also shows a closer connection between the Guthrie–Baskett family of Branch B and the tested John William Guthrie–Elizabeth White family of Branch G. Their connecting ancestor is estimated to have been born around 1776, but the possible date range extends back into the 1600s and must be considered alongside the earlier relationships recorded in their pedigrees.
Big-Y adds to the evidence from the other Y-DNA tests; every branch’s results still matter. The documented Craigie line in Branch A and the Snow Hill family in Branch D share useful marker patterns with the Patrick–Agnes Foord and Godfrey lines. Those clues already give us closer connections to investigate. Big-Y results from Craigie or Snow Hill would help clarify where those families fit, while records remain essential for naming the ancestors and checking each generation.
Big-Y Branches & Their Estimated Common AncestorsOpen to see which lines belong together and what the dates mean.
Reading the technical labels: a haplogroup is a named branch of the paternal DNA tree. The letter-and-number codes below identify those genetic branches; they are separate from the project’s family labels, such as Branch A or Branch B. MRCA means “most recent common ancestor,” the latest man shared along the compared father-to-son lines.
STRs are repeating stretches of DNA compared by their repeat counts. SNPs are changes at individual DNA positions used to define the Big-Y branches. Both contribute evidence; neither supplies a complete named family tree by itself.
The tested tree descends through R-Y62042 → R-FT13875. Within FT13875, two branches separate, and one divides again:
Guthrie–Foord and Godfrey
Kits 72673 and 294936
An additional tester is shown as Michael Guthrie. His project branch and documentary lineage have not been identified in this comparison; he is separate from Michael Brown Guthrie, kit 867625.
Within it: R-FT13535Kits 259168, 867625, and 894217 form a closer cluster.
| Genetic Branch | Estimated Period | What It Means |
|---|---|---|
| R-FT13875 | Estimated birth around 1421 | The ancestor joining the FTA50022 and FT13971 branches predates the closer ancestors within either branch. |
| R-FTA50022 | Estimated birth around 1651 | Foord and Godfrey share a later paternal ancestor with each other than with the FT13971 branch. His identity remains unresolved. |
| R-FT13971 | Broadly around 1750 | The three FT13535 men share an earlier connection with the additional Guthrie tester on this broader branch. |
| R-FT13535 | Estimated birth around 1776 | A closer cluster represented by the recorded Henry, Garritt, and John William Guthrie descendant lines. Its estimated date must be compared with the pedigrees and the full uncertainty range. |
The 1421, 1651, and 1776 estimates are the birth estimates displayed in the FamilyTreeDNA Match Time Tree popups captured on 3 October 2026. The FT13971 estimate remains a broad reading of the chart. These are statistical estimates, not recorded birth dates. The bars show uncertainty, but exact range endpoints are not supplied in these screenshots.
The estimate comes with a broad uncertainty range. The FT13535 time-tree popup estimates birth around 1776; the earlier Haplogroup Story summarizes the date as about 1800. The time-tree uncertainty bar extends back into the 1600s. The Story’s separate formation estimate of about 1750 concerns separation from the parent branch; formation and the most recent shared ancestor answer different questions.
How this compares with the proposed pedigree: kits 867625 and 894217 are recorded through Garritt and Henry Guthrie, respectively, both placed as sons of the same John Guthrie. If those descents are correct, their paternal connection must reach back at least to that father’s generation. Kit 259168 represents the John William Guthrie–Elizabeth White line, whose earlier attachment remains provisional. The 1776 point estimate does not settle those links or, by itself, disprove them. It is a reason to compare the dated records with the full genetic estimate.
What Big-Y establishes more clearly than a date: Foord and Godfrey belong together on one branch; the three FT13535 men belong together on another. The DNA branching is meaningful even while the names of the connecting ancestors remain under investigation.
A deeper connection with other surnames: the R-Y62042 popup estimates a shared ancestor’s birth around 863. This older branch also connects the displayed Cherrington, Powell, Corbett, and McConnell lines. It is a different comparison from the approximately 1421 ancestor joining the two main tested Guthrie branches. A shared ancestor this far back does not by itself identify a recent surname change.
The FTA50022 SNP block also contains BY172072, FTA49369, FTA51256, and FTE48825. The FT13971 block includes FT12837 and FT13021. These shared changes define genetic branches; their labels do not identify the men in whom the changes first occurred.
Inherited Clues in the Family Lines
Some families share recognizable combinations of DNA marker values. Descendants of the Snow Hill family in Branch D share a particularly useful pattern. Within the Guthrie–Baskett family of Branch B, descendants following separate family paths also share a marker value worth following. These patterns can help recognize related descendant lines and guide the search for their connections.
The broader pattern linking Craigie, the Patrick–Agnes Foord family, Godfrey, and Snow Hill is another promising clue. A marker can change more than once or reach the same value in different families, so the strongest conclusions come from comparing several markers, independently documented lines, and any available Big-Y results together.
Which Inherited Marker Patterns Stand Out?Open for the marker values, represented lines, and their genealogical meaning.
“Usual value” below means the most frequent value among the available GFG1A results in this comparison. It is not automatically the value carried by the original common ancestor.
| Lines Compared | Shared Pattern | What the Pattern Suggests |
|---|---|---|
| Snow HillKits 290792, 846168, 952892 | All three: DYS392=14 rather than 13, together with CDY=38–39. The two Y111 kits also share DYS557=18 and DYS504=16; the usual values are 17 at both. |
A strong candidate family pattern across the recorded John S, George Leonard, and Leonard lines. All three agree at Y37; 846168 and 952892 differ by only one step at Y111. Leonard’s exact documentary attachment remains qualified. The Y37 kit has no observed results at DYS557 or DYS504. |
| Craigie, Foord, Godfrey & Snow HillKits 74203, 72673, 294936, 846168, 952892 | DYS712=19 and DYS513=12, compared with the usual 18 and 13. | A possible shared ancestral pattern linking these lines more closely within the wider group. All five share it; the other nine GFG1A kits with full Y111 results do not. Craigie and Snow Hill still need Big-Y placement to test how this STR grouping relates to the SNP branches. |
| Craigie & FoordKits 74203 and 72673 | DYS525=11, compared with the usual 10. | An additional clue favoring investigation of their closer connection. It does not establish James Guthrie as their MRCA or resolve which Patrick married Agnes Foord. |
| Foord & GodfreyKits 72673 and 294936 | DYS650=19, compared with the usual 20. | A shared STR clue that agrees with their independently established R-FTA50022 grouping. Their common ancestor still needs a documentary identity. |
| William Guthrie & Elisabeth Sheppard DescendantsKits 137621 and 163223 | DYS710=35, compared with the usual 34. | A plausible inherited pattern found through two recorded sons, William Jackson and James Martin. Another James Martin descendant, kit 405750, has Y67 and has not tested this marker. The change could have originated in William or an earlier paternal ancestor. |
The important distinction: the Snow Hill and Sheppard patterns can help recognize particular descendant families. The Craigie–Foord–Godfrey–Snow Hill pattern may point to an older connection among several branches. Neither kind of STR pattern replaces the records or establishes a new Big-Y branch.
Why the Closest STR Match Is Not Always the Closest BranchOpen for examples from these results and the additional Big-Y STR clues.
Foord and Godfrey are nine steps apart at Y111, yet Big-Y places them together at FTA50022. Godfrey is a closer STR match to the documented Craigie tester, kit 74203, at six steps. Craigie and Foord are eleven steps apart. Those counts do not overturn the SNP tree or tell us where Craigie belongs within it.
The Godfrey connection: an unrecorded paternal link, often called an NPE, is a working explanation for his relationship to the Guthrie group. The event, its circumstances, and its generation have not been established. The shared DNA ancestor could have lived generations before a later change in the recorded paternal line or surname. The 1776 estimate, summarized as about 1800 in the earlier Story, belongs to the separate FT13535 cluster. It does not date Godfrey’s possible NPE. The Foord–Godfrey shared ancestor is estimated around 1651, and any later event changing the recorded paternal line could have occurred generations afterward.
Likewise, kits 259168, 969866, and 387223 agree across all 111 standard markers, but only 259168 has a confirmed FT13535 result in the evidence reviewed here. An exact STR match is not enough to assign that same final Big-Y branch to the other two.
The confirmed FT13535 trio—259168, 867625, and 894217—are one to three steps apart at Y111. Their differences distinguish the individual results while their shared SNPs place them together on the same branch.
Additional STRs From the Big-Y Exports
Beyond Y111, the three FT13535 men share four values that differ from the available Foord result:
| Marker | FT13535 Trio | Foord · 72673 |
|---|---|---|
| DYS512 | 12 | 11 |
| DYS541 | 12 | 13 |
| FTY535 | 11 | 12 |
| FTY839 | 14 | 15 |
These are promising values to compare in further results. Godfrey’s additional STRs are unavailable, so we cannot yet tell whether the Foord values characterize their shared FTA50022 branch or only Foord’s particular line. His standard Y111 results are included in the comparisons above.
A missing result at an additional Big-Y STR means that no reliable value was reported. It is not counted as a mismatch. The standard-panel distances above were calculated from the allele values; they are not dates or counts of proven historical mutation events.
Why the traditional pedigree needs a fresh reading
Many descendants understood their connection to the Guthries of Guthrie through the same familiar published tree. Research in our Special Collections sources identifies the Eassie–Hiltoun family as a separate line and overturns the traditional route connecting these families. Those earlier conclusions reflected the pedigree available to researchers; the evidence has changed.
The genetic relationships remain, while the historical route connecting the branches requires reassessment. A medieval DNA estimate does not restore the discarded pedigree or establish descent from the Guthries of Guthrie. Compare the 1772 and 1773 Craigie pedigrees with the Eassie & Hiltoun reconstruction.
Participating Y-DNA Kits & Short LineagesOpen for the family paths represented in the Big-Y comparison.
Kit 74203 — Craigie: James Guthrie & Christian Scott → their son James Guthrie of Craigie → James Guthrie & Amelia Murray → George Dempster Guthrie. Y-DNA111; displayed haplogroup R-M269.
Kit 72673 — Guthrie–Foord: Patrick Guthrie & Agnes Foord → Patrick Guthrie → Patrick “Peter” Guthrie → John Guthrie. Big-Y 700; confirmed R-FTA50022. The proposed connection from Patrick and Agnes back to James and Christian remains provisional.
Kit 294936 — Godfrey: Big-Y 700; confirmed R-FTA50022. This related paternal line has an unresolved documentary connection to the Guthrie families. It is not counted as another established child-line of James and Christian.
Kit 867625 — Garritt’s Line, GFG1A Branch B: John Guthrie & Elizabeth Baskett → John Guthrie → Garritt → Charles → Vincent → Joel Johnson. Big-Y 700; R-FT13535.
Kit 894217 — Henry’s Line, GFG1A Branch B: John Guthrie & Elizabeth Baskett → John Guthrie → Henry Guthrie & Penelope Johnson → John Guthrie & Nancy Ann Crump. Big-Y 700; R-FT13535.
Kit 259168 — GFG1A Branch G: John William Guthrie & Elizabeth White → George Wyatt Guthrie & Cornelia Grass → John William Guthrie & Willie Fontaine Dawson. Big-Y 700; R-FT13535. The earlier proposed connection to William Guthrie and Elizabeth Wingfield remains provisional.
These are condensed recorded pedigrees, not an assertion that DNA alone proves every parent–child connection. Later generations and the supporting research remain in the Guthrie Research Tree and the individual GFG1A branch accounts.
A note on the group names: GFG1A Branch B is part of the matching GFG1A paternal family. The separate labels GFG1B and GFG1C identify families associated through their recorded pedigrees whose tested paternal lines differ genetically from GFG1A. They are not the Big-Y subdivisions shown above.
Where Further DNA Testing Could HelpOpen for the questions behind the testing opportunities.
A Craigie Big-Y result could clarify where that documented line sits relative to the Guthrie–Foord result and the other GFG1A branches. The existing Y111 participant is deceased; permission and feasibility for an upgrade have not been established. Additional willing, documented direct male-line Craigie descendants are welcome.
Another son’s paternal line could provide an independent comparison, including a surviving male line through Alexander and Taybank if one can be documented. The value lies in a distinct descent path as well as the number of participants.
The Rescobie candidate’s family offers a further research direction: a securely documented male-line descendant of Thomas Guthrie’s family could help compare the competing paternal connections. No such comparative result is presently identified here.
The Patrick–Agnes Foord line already has Big-Y representation. Additional results would be most useful when they answer a specific lineage question.
The other children: John and Robert’s descendant lines need further tracing. Thomas, William, and Hendri need clearer accounts of their later lives and whether they had children. Issobell’s later life and descendants also remain research opportunities, although James’s Y-DNA cannot pass through her.
DNA Sources & Reading the ResultsOpen for the project evidence and plain-language explanations.
- Guthrie DNA Project: participant pedigrees, standard Y-STR results, and Big-Y STR exports reviewed 3 October 2026; Big-Y Block Tree and FT13535 Haplogroup Story dated 2 October 2026, with Match Time Tree date popups captured 3 October 2026.
- Public Guthrie Y-DNA results — compare the published marker values. Public visibility varies by participant.
- FamilyTreeDNA: STRs, SNPs, and marker values.
- FamilyTreeDNA: reading the Time Tree and its uncertainty bars.
- FamilyTreeDNA: STR panels and missing calls.
DNA information reviewed: 3 October 2026. Genetic time estimates use the Match Time Tree popups captured 3 October 2026 and the earlier Story dated 2 October 2026. Kit numbers identify project records; genetic placement and documentary ancestry are assessed separately.
Family-Specific Records & Sources
These records provide the foundation for the family reconstruction. The individual children’s pages carry fuller accounts of their marriages, descendants, and later lives.
Dundee Parish Records — Marriage, Children & KinOpen for the family relationships recorded in the registers.
Marriage, 1695: James Guthrie and Christian Scott, Dundee Old Parish Registers, reference 282/120/18. The April day is inconsistently reported: the register index gives 25 April, while some accounts give 23 April.
Children’s baptisms, 1695–1707: eight located entries name children of this couple. Their dates are baptism dates. Witnesses and naming information add relatives, including Patrick Scott, mariner, and Henry Scott, merchant in London.
Christian Scott living in 1724: the Dundee baptism of Christian, daughter of John Guthrie and Ann Dempster, on 6 January 1724 names Christian Scott as grandmother in the witness information.
Alexander’s parentage: although his own baptism has not been located, records for his children identify James Guthrie and Christian Scott as grandparents and connect the family with James Guthrie of Craigie. These records establish a relationship that the missing baptism alone cannot supply.
Search the original parish registers at ScotlandsPeople · Explore Alexander’s family evidence
James Guthrie’s Epitaph — Stockholm, Dundee & His FamilyOpen for the occupational evidence and the date comparison.
James Thomson’s The History of Dundee (1874), p. 394, monument no. 6, prints an English rendering of James’s epitaph. It identifies his father as Mr John Guthrie, pastor in Dundee, describes mercantile training in Stockholm and subsequent international trade, and names his wife Christian Scott.
The inscription gives 1 April 1710 and an age of 46, supporting an approximate birth in 1663–1664. This differs from the 1669 birth and 1711 death found in later accounts. Christian paid for the memorial, which records a surviving wife and seven sons.
The judge mentioned in the rendering is a relative of James. The passage does not identify James himself as a judge, and the relative’s name and relationship remain unknown.
Rev. John Guthrie’s Testament — The Earlier HouseholdOpen for the minister’s family and the surviving testament reference.
The testament dated 4 April 1684, registered 6 November 1688, is preserved under CC3/3/7, images 419–421. It identifies John and Isobell as the minister’s eldest son and daughter and supplies further family relationships.
The Mr James Guthrie described as the testator’s brother must be distinguished from the merchant James in the next generation. The registration date is also distinct from the date the testament was written.
Find the testament through ScotlandsPeople · Compare the ministerial family in the Fasti research
The Lyon Pedigrees & the Eassie–Hiltoun EvidenceOpen to follow the traditional ancestry, its correction, and the supporting sources.
25 September 1772: the Craigie armorial pedigree, Coats of Arms, vol. 1, p. 496Z, record 1133, misplaced Bishop John Guthrie in relation to the earlier Hiltoun generations.
29 September 1773: the corrected Lyon Office pedigree, p. 499, no. 45, restores omitted generations. It traces the ancestry from William Guthrie of Hiltoun and Margaret Ogilvie through St Andrews, the ministers, and the Dundee merchant family.
The correction remains valuable, but its repeated claim of descent from the ancient Guthries of Guthrie does not establish the traditional connection overturned by the Special Collections reconstruction. The earliest parent–child links must still be assessed against contemporary records.
- Craigie: comparison of the 1772 and 1773 pedigrees.
- Eassie & Hiltoun: the reconstructed family and documentary evidence.
- Great Seal of Scotland, Volume II: see no. 2910, dated 19 January 1505/06, for John Guthrie of Hiltoun. It does not by itself prove William’s parentage.
- Register of the Bishopric of Brechin: vol. II, p. 173, the 10 May 1518 record of Alexander Ramsay and Joneta Guthre. The identification of Joneta as William’s daughter comes from the later Bamff pedigree and must be distinguished from the contemporary marriage evidence.
Patrick Guthrie & Agnes Foord — Comparing the CandidatesOpen for the positive evidence and the unresolved identification.
Dundee candidate: Patrick, son of James Guthrie and Christian Scott, baptized 5 October 1704. He was of a suitable age for the 1726 marriage, and a descendant of Patrick and Agnes belongs to the same paternal DNA group as the documented Craigie line.
Rescobie candidate: Patrick, baptized 29 August 1700, a son of Thomas Guthrie and twin of James; the entry does not name the mother. He was also of a suitable age.
The 3 June 1726 marriage belongs to the Patrick–Agnes Foord family associated with St Vigeans and Arbirlot. The missing connection is a record identifying the adult husband with one of these childhood families. A shared paternal ancestor could precede both candidates, so the Y-DNA match alone does not choose between them.
Craigie & Taybank — Property and Descendant RecordsOpen for the later branches and their supporting studies.
Craigie, 1729: National Records of Scotland GD137/3167 describes an account concerning the price of Craigie lands sold by James and George Kyd to James Guthrie. The catalogue date identifies the account; it should not automatically be treated as the exact date of the original purchase.
The Craigie branch descends through James and Christian’s son James. The Taybank branch descends through their son Alexander. Their detailed property histories and later generations are explored in the dedicated studies.
View the NRS catalogue entry · Guthrie of Craigie · Guthrie of Taybank
Reference Sources & Further Reading
Repositories, Published Histories & Comparative PedigreesOpen for the wider reading and research tools.
- ScotlandsPeople — parish registers, wills and testaments, and heraldic records.
- National Records of Scotland Catalogue — property, estate, court, and family papers.
- Fasti Ecclesiæ Scoticanæ research — the ministerial generations and their family relationships.
- James Thomson, The History of Dundee (1874) — local history and the published epitaph.
- Alexander Wedderburn, The Wedderburn Book (1898) — family and social connections involving the Dundee Guthries.
- The Peerage — James Guthrie, Christian Scott, and the Guthrie name index.
- Stirnet’s Guthrie pedigrees — comparative family material; access may require registration or a subscription.
- Barony of Craigie — a general orientation to the estate and its succession.
Compiled pedigrees are useful for comparison and locating leads. Relationships and dates should be checked against the cited records, particularly where the traditional ancestry has been revised.
Most Wanted Records
A well-identified record can settle a relationship, distinguish two people of the same name, or reveal a part of the family’s life that a pedigree leaves out.
Most Wanted Documents & the Questions They Could AnswerOpen for the specific evidence we are seeking.
- Patrick Guthrie’s childhood-to-adult connection. A testament, marriage contract, property record, apprenticeship, or other document naming Agnes Foord’s husband with his parents or siblings. Compare Dundee, Rescobie, St Vigeans, Arbirlot, and Arbroath records.
- A contemporary record of James’s Stockholm apprenticeship. Seek a master’s name, merchant or guild entry, correspondence, or trading account that identifies the Dundee minister’s son. Swedish merchant records and Scottish commercial papers are possible avenues.
- The judge named only by relationship in the epitaph. The original Latin, another reliable transcription, or civic and family records may identify him. Paternal, maternal Lamb, and marriage connections remain avenues to investigate.
- Christian Scott’s later life and death. She is documented as a grandmother in 1724. A burial, testament, property transaction, or family record could establish what followed.
- Alexander Guthrie’s baptism. His parentage is supported by his children’s records; his own baptism could establish the missing date and place within the sibling sequence.
- The earliest links in the corrected Hiltoun–St Andrews pedigree. Contemporary records naming William of Hiltoun’s parents, or connecting Charles Guthrie and Agnes Brown with Patrick the St Andrews goldsmith, would test links preserved in the 1773 account. The Craigie and Eassie–Hiltoun studies set out these earlier questions in greater detail.
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