1A-A: Robert Guthrie
Guthrie Family Group 1A · Branch A · The Next Generation
Robert Guthrie & Jean Fowler
Merchant in Dundee · Angus, Scotland
Robert Guthrie, son of James Guthrie and Christian Scott, belonged to Dundee’s merchant community. He married Jean Fowler on 3 August 1726. His daughter Clara’s marriage to Sir William Moncreiffe connects this household with the Moncreiffe family of Perthshire.
The parish registers preserve both family ties and an unresolved question: two children’s baptism entries name the mother as Ann Fuller. Follow the children and explore the evidence behind these differing names.
The Family
Robert Guthrie
- Parents
- James Guthrie, merchant, & Christian Scott
- Birth & Baptism
- Birth date unconfirmed. Baptised 8 June 1699 in Dundee, Angus, Scotland.
- Death
- Not confirmed. A possible Dundee burial is dated 7 May 1784.
- Occupation
- Merchant in Dundee
Jean Fowler
- Parents
- Not yet identified
- Birth & Baptism
- No birth date or baptism has been securely identified.
- Death
- Date and burial remain unconfirmed.
- Occupation / Role
- Merchant’s wife
Married 3 August 1726 · Dundee, Angus, Scotland
Robert belonged to a family whose livelihood and relationships were closely woven into Dundee’s merchant community. His children’s baptismal entries name his mother, Christian Scott, his brother James Guthrie of Craigie, and relatives in the Dempster and Gardyne families. These connections help distinguish this household from other Guthrie families in the parish.
Six children are recorded for Robert between 1728 and 1737. Jean Fowler is his documented wife, although two baptismal entries name the mother as Ann Fuller. Their differing names remain an open question. Through Clara’s marriage to Sir William Moncreiffe, this family’s descendants also became part of the Moncreiffe family of Perthshire.
Explore the Next Generation
Select a child’s name to explore their story and family below.
| Child | Baptism | Marriage & Later Life |
|---|---|---|
| Christian | 29 May 1728 | No marriage, children, or death have been securely identified. |
| James | 11 September 1729 | His mother is entered as Ann Fuller. His later life remains untraced. |
| Clara | 26 April 1731 | Married Sir William Moncreiffe, 4th Baronet. Two recorded children: Jean and Thomas. The marriage date remains unknown. |
| Jean | 18 June 1732 | No marriage, children, or death have been securely identified. |
| Ann | 17 August 1734 | Her later life remains untraced. |
| Elizabeth | 17 October 1737 | Her later life remains untraced. |
Family Evidence Notes Open for Jean Fowler, Ann Fuller, baptism dates, and the possible 1784 burial.
Births and baptisms. The table gives Dundee baptism dates, which should not automatically be treated as birth dates. Robert’s baptism is dated 8 June 1699. A separate birth date of 4 June is reported but remains unconfirmed.
Jean Fowler and Ann Fuller. Robert’s marriage to Jean Fowler is recorded on 3 August 1726. James’s 1729 baptism names his mother as Ann Fuller (OPR 282/40/84). In Clara’s 1731 entry, the given name appears to have been changed from Jean to Ann; the surname is Fuller (OPR 282/40/102). Other entries name Jean, with Fowler, Fouler, and Fuller appearing in records or transcriptions. Variation in the surname alone does not explain the change in given name.
The Moncreiffe grandchildren. Jean Moncreiffe, born 17 May and baptised 19 May 1757, has “Mrs Jean Guthrie” entered as her mother, while Jean Fowler is explicitly named as grandmother. Thomas Moncreiffe, born 7 June and baptised 9 June 1758, has Clara Guthrie entered as his mother; Robert Guthrie, merchant in Dundee, also appears among the names in that entry. Read together with the Moncreiffe family history, these records support Clara’s connection to Jean Fowler while preserving another inconsistency in the mother’s given name.
What remains unresolved. Recording errors are a possible explanation, but the surviving entries do not establish that Jean Fowler and Ann Fuller were the same woman or that Robert had a second wife. Neither of the disputed baptism entries explicitly identifies the child as illegitimate. The later Moncreiffe records do not independently resolve James’s maternal identity.
Robert’s possible burial. A Dundee entry headed “Buryings in 1784” records Robert Guthrie on 7 May 1784. It gives no age, occupation, or relatives to identify him as this merchant. The date is therefore retained as a possible burial, not an established death date. Jean Fowler’s death and burial also remain unconfirmed.
Sources: Dundee Old Parish Registers, including the 1726 marriage, the children’s baptisms, the Moncreiffe baptisms of 1757–1758, and the 1784 burial entry. Further references appear in Explore the Records.
Children & Descendant Families
The children’s baptismal entries connect Robert’s household with their Guthrie relatives in Dundee and at Craigie. Clara’s marriage extends this family into the Moncreiffe baronets and, in a later generation, the family of the Earls of Bradford.
The six Guthrie baptisms below were recorded in Dundee. Their baptism dates should not be treated as confirmed birth dates. Later marriages and families have been identified for Clara; the other children’s later lives remain untraced.
1. Christian Guthrie
Baptised 29 May 1728
Christian’s baptism names her grandmother, Christian Scott. No marriage, children, or burial has been securely connected to Robert and Jean’s daughter.
Three cousins named ChristianWhich marriages belong to the other branches?
The Christian Guthrie who married Robert Speid on 2 September 1755 was a daughter of John Guthrie and Ann Dempster. The Christian who married Richard Neilson on 25 November 1762 was a daughter of James Guthrie of Craigie and Elizabeth Gardyn. Both were cousins of this Christian.
Dundee burial entries from 1797 and 1800 remain possible research leads, but neither has been identified as Robert’s daughter.
2. James Guthrie
Baptised 11 September 1729
James’s baptism names his father as Robert Guthrie, merchant, and identifies James Guthrie of Craigie as his uncle. The mother is recorded as Ann Fuller, a discrepancy discussed in the Family Evidence Notes. His later life and any descendants remain unknown.
3. Clara Guthrie & Sir William Moncreiffe
Baptised 26 April 1731 · Death reported in 1785
Clara’s baptism names Clara Fletcher, Lady of Eassie. She married Sir William Moncreiffe of that Ilk, fourth Baronet (1732–1784). Their marriage date and place have not been found, but their children’s parish entries and the published Moncreiffe history establish the family connection.
| Child | Life & Family |
|---|---|
| Jean | Born 17 May 1757; baptised 19 May 1757, Dundee. Married Adam Cunningham of Bonnington in Perth on 4 February 1782, the register records them as contracted on 2 February. No children have been securely identified. |
| Thomas | Born 7 June 1758; baptised 9 June 1758, Dundee. Succeeded his father as fifth Baronet in 1784. Married Lady Elizabeth Ramsay, daughter of the Earl of Dalhousie, at Dalhousie Castle on 13 August 1786. He died on 26 March 1818. |
| Child | Life & Family |
|---|---|
| David | 31 December 1788–20 November 1830. Became Sir David Moncreiffe, sixth Baronet. Married Helen Mackay on 12 January 1819. They had two sons and two daughters. |
| Georgina Elizabeth | 1790–1842. Married George Augustus Bridgeman, second Earl of Bradford, in 1818, connecting Clara’s descendants with the Bradford family. |
Clara’s Family: What the Parish Entries SayNames, dates, and the connection to Jean Fowler.
Jean’s baptism, 1757: the mother’s name is written as Jean Guthrie, while Jean Fowler is explicitly named as the child’s grandmother. The mother’s name must be preserved when transcribing the entry, even though the reconstructed family identifies Sir William’s wife as Clara.
Thomas’s baptism, 1758: the mother is clearly Clara Guthrie. Robert Guthrie, merchant in Dundee, also appears in the names column. The abbreviation G. Father has not been securely interpreted or attached to a particular person, so it is not treated as an explicit statement of biological relationship.
Together, these entries support Clara’s connection to Jean Fowler and suggest a naming inconsistency in Jean’s baptism. They do not settle every Ann Fuller reference in Robert’s children’s records. The fuller discussion appears in the Family Evidence Notes.
Dates: Thomas’s original entry gives a June birth and baptism, not the January birth found in some later pedigrees. Clara’s death is reported in March 1785, but published derivative accounts disagree over the day; an original record is still needed.
Jean Moncreiffe: A Marriage to Keep SeparateWhy Peter Provan is not listed as her second husband.
The 1782 Perth entry identifies the bride of Adam Cunningham as Sir William Moncreiffe’s daughter. The ceremony was conducted by Adam Peebles, minister of the Episcopal congregation in Perth. The groom’s name is Adam, not Andrew.
An Edinburgh marriage dated 13 February 1797 joins Peter Provan, a gentleman’s servant, and Jean Moncreiff, daughter of William Moncreiff, breeches maker. Those identifying details do not establish that she was the baronet’s daughter. This marriage, and the associated child William, are therefore kept separate from Clara’s family.
Lady Elizabeth Ramsay & MoredunA later chapter in the Moncreiffe family.
The Scottish Nation describes Thomas and Elizabeth’s marriage as unhappy. It reports that Baron David Stuart Moncreiffe, who had helped arrange the match, left Elizabeth the estate of Moredun in Liberton, near Edinburgh. This is a published account; the original settlement has not been examined here.
Elizabeth survived Thomas by thirty years. The same source reports her death on 3 June 1848 from injuries sustained when her dress accidentally caught fire.
Further reading: George Seton, The House of Moncrieff (1890), pp. 68–69; and the Moncreiff entry in The Scottish Nation. Original parish entries provide the birth, baptism, and marriage details discussed above.
4. Jean Guthrie
Baptised 18 June 1732
Jean’s baptism names Jean Graham, whose accompanying territorial designation has not been securely read. No marriage or later family has been confirmed for this daughter.
5. Ann Guthrie
Baptised 17 August 1734
Ann’s baptism names Ann Dempster, wife of Robert’s brother John Guthrie, and Ann Fowler, explicitly described as an aunt. The entry preserves useful connections with the Dempster and Fowler families. Ann’s later life has not been traced.
6. Elizabeth Guthrie
Baptised 17 October 1737
Elizabeth’s baptism identifies Elizabeth Gardyn, Lady of Craigie, as her aunt. She was the wife of Robert’s brother James Guthrie of Craigie. No later marriage, children, or death has been securely connected to this Elizabeth.
Explore the Records
The Dundee parish registers place Robert within a merchant family and preserve connections with his siblings, the Fowlers, and the Moncreiffes. Comparing entries across generations helps explain the family’s relationships while showing which questions remain open.
The Guthrie DNA Project
No Y-DNA representative has been identified for Robert’s line, and no autosomal participant is currently recorded for this household in the family research. Results from the wider family are discussed at the GFG1A Hub.
How Descendants Can HelpWhich family lines could contribute to the DNA research?
Y-DNA: a man descended from Robert through an uninterrupted father-to-son line could represent Robert’s paternal branch. James, baptised in 1729, is his only recorded son, but James’s later life and any descendants have not been established.
Descendants through daughters: Clara’s Moncreiffe descendants, and descendants of any of her sisters, could contribute family records and autosomal comparisons. They would not carry Robert’s Y-DNA through a Guthrie daughter.
Autosomal DNA: these tests draw on many ancestral lines. At this distance, a descendant may retain no detectable DNA from a particular ancestor. A missing match would not disprove descent, and a match alone would not establish that Robert and Jean were the shared ancestors.
If you descend from this family, please share your documented lineage and any testing information through Guthrie Genealogy’s contact page. Participation in the family research does not require a DNA test.
DNA background: FamilyTreeDNA’s explanations of paternal-line testing and autosomal inheritance.
Family-Specific Records
OPR means Old Parish Registers. Search the names, dates, and parishes below at ScotlandsPeople. Manuscript page numbers and digital viewer image numbers are listed separately where a complete register reference is not available.
| Record | What It Tells Us |
|---|---|
| Robert’s Baptism8 June 1699 · Dundee | Identifies Robert as a son of James Guthrie and Christian Scott. A birth date of 4 June is reported, but the established event is his baptism on 8 June. |
| Robert & Jean’s Marriage3 August 1726 · Dundee | Documents the marriage of Robert Guthrie and Jean Fowler. The disputed names in later baptismal entries do not, by themselves, establish another marriage. |
| James’s Baptism11 September 1729 · Dundee OPR 282/40/84 |
Names Robert Guthrie, merchant, and Ann Fuller. James Guthrie, the child’s uncle and Laird of Craigie, helps connect the entry to this household. The mother’s identity remains unresolved. |
| Clara’s Baptism26 April 1731 · Dundee OPR 282/40/102 |
The mother’s given name appears altered from Jean to Ann, with the surname Fuller. Clara Fletcher, Lady of Eassie, is named in the entry. The alteration’s date and reason are unknown. |
| Jean Moncreiffe’s Baptism19 May 1757 · Dundee Manuscript p. 39; viewer image 81 of 552 |
Records birth on 17 May. The mother is written as Jean Guthrie; Jean Fowler is explicitly called the child’s grandmother. This must be compared with the records identifying Sir William’s wife as Clara. |
| Thomas Moncreiffe’s Baptism9 June 1758 · Dundee Manuscript p. 48; viewer image 99 of 552 |
Records birth on 7 June and clearly names Clara Guthrie as mother. Robert Guthrie, merchant in Dundee, is also named. The abbreviation “G. Father” remains unresolved. |
| Possible Robert Guthrie Burial7 May 1784 · Dundee Manuscript p. 132; viewer image 134 of 343 |
The burial register names Robert Guthrie but gives no age, occupation, spouse, or address. This is a genuine burial entry, but its identification with this merchant is unconfirmed. It does not supply a death date. |
Namesakes & Evidence from Related HouseholdsOpen for the relatives and associates named in the registers.
A description such as grandmother, aunt, or uncle supplies a relationship. A name alone does not prove kinship, and commemorative wording does not necessarily show that a person was living or present.
- Robert’s baptism, 1699: the existing transcription names Robert Lamb of Aldbar, Robert Rait, minister of Dundee, Robert Lauderdale, customs surveyor, and Robert Watson, merchant. Their occupations must not be transferred to the infant Robert Guthrie.
- Christian, 1728: Christian Scott is identified as grandmother. Mrs Christian Thepland also appears in the transcription, without an established relationship.
- Jean, 1732: Jean Graham is named, with an uncertain territorial designation transcribed as “Ballanscho(?)”. The mother’s surname also requires care: Fuller appears in the existing transcription, while Fowler appears in other family records.
- Ann, 1734: Ann Dempster, wife of John Guthrie, and Ann Fowler, aunt, are named. Ann Fowler is a useful lead for Jean’s family; she has not been identified as the Ann Fuller in the disputed entries.
- John and Ann Dempster’s daughter Jean, 1736: her baptism names Jean Fowler as Robert Guthrie’s wife, providing another reference to the couple in a related household.
- Elizabeth, 1737: Elizabeth Gardyn, Lady of Craigie, is explicitly described as an aunt.
The evidence supports retaining Jean Fowler as Robert’s documented wife while leaving the Ann Fuller entries unresolved. It does not establish a second wife, prove illegitimacy, or demonstrate that every discrepancy was a clerical error.
Jean Fowler’s Origins: Candidate BaptismsOpen for the index leads; none has been identified as Robert’s wife.
Earlier index searches produced the following possibilities. These are research leads, not a list of equally likely candidates. The dates, places, parents, and later lives must be tested against Jean’s 1726 marriage and her known family connections.
| Date & Parish | Indexed Child & Parents |
|---|---|
| 14 March 1691 Aberdeen |
Jean Fouler; Andrew Fouler and Anna Forbes. |
| 17 June 1705 Kinloss |
Jean Fowler; father William Fowler. |
| 2 November 1706 South Leith |
Jean Fouler; Andrew Fouler and Elizabeth Ovens. |
| 13 February 1707 Duns |
Jean Fouler; George Fouler and Jean Darling. |
| 13 April 1707 Montrose |
Jean Fowler; Alexander Fowler and Isa. Dickie. |
| 17 September 1710 Drumoak |
Jean Fouler; father Patrick Fouler. |
| 13 April 1712 North Leith |
Jean Fouler; David Fouler and Isabell Haddin. |
| 22 February 1713 Aberlour |
Jean Fowler; father John Fowler. |
| 27 September 1713 Kincardine |
Jean Fowlerton; Arthur Fowlerton and Isobel Forbes. |
The Montrose entry is the only Angus result in this search, but proximity alone does not establish identity. The later dates also require particular scrutiny against the marriage chronology. Baptism dates should not automatically be treated as birth dates.
Searches for Ann Fuller and Ann Fowler in the same 1690–1714 range found no entries under those forms; four Anna Fowler results were reported outside Angus. These limited negative searches do not prove that Ann Fuller was an invented name or a recording error.
Moncreiffe Marriage Records & Published HistoriesOpen for the sources behind Clara’s descendants and the conflicting details.
Parish Marriage Entries
Jean Moncreiffe and Adam Cunningham, Perth: the entry records them as contracted on 2 February 1782 and married on 4 February. It identifies Jean as Sir William Moncreiffe’s daughter. A separate 1797 Edinburgh marriage to Peter Provan identifies a bride whose father was a breeches maker; that marriage remains separate from this family.
Thomas Moncreiffe and Lady Elizabeth Ramsay: the entry states that they married at Dalhousie Castle on 13 August 1786. Its later September notation should not be substituted for the stated wedding date.
The House of Moncrieff
George Seton’s The House of Moncrieff (1890), printed pages 68–69, connects Clara with Sir William, their children Jean and Thomas, and the later Moncreiffe and Bradford families. It is a published family history to compare with the original registers.
These pages support 7 June 1758 for Thomas’s birth and Adam as Jean’s husband. Some derivative pedigrees instead give January or Andrew. Clara’s reported March 1785 death also appears with conflicting days, so an exact day is not treated as settled.
A 1743 anecdote on page 68 appears to associate Clara with a gift of garden produce. The chronology is problematic for a woman baptised in 1731; the underlying source and the woman’s identity require checking before using the anecdote in her biography.
The Scottish Nation
The Moncreiff entry in The Scottish Nation supplies the account of Lady Elizabeth Ramsay and Moredun, and her death in 1848. The original settlement would be needed to examine the estate arrangements directly.
Special Collections & Dundee Research SourcesOpen for merchant records, testaments, and the wider family.
- Guthrie of Craigie: related family and estate research concerning Robert’s brother James and the Craigie descendants. Robert’s description as a merchant should not be turned into ownership of Craigie.
- Commissariot of Brechin: a finding aid for testaments and relatives named in estate descriptions. Its Robert Guthrie, merchant in Dundee, entry is dated 8 January 1677 and belongs to an earlier man, not Robert baptised in 1699.
- Dundee City Archives: Research Before 1855: a guide to parish and burial records, the Lockit Book of burgesses, wills, deeds, and burgh records. Burgess entries can sometimes identify a father or apprenticeship connection. These are sources to investigate, not records already assigned to Robert.
- Special Collections Directory: access the wider Guthrie finding aids and published-source studies.
- Robert in the Guthrie Research Tree: follow the connected family profiles and compare their supporting records.
Most Wanted DocumentsOpen to see which discoveries could answer the remaining questions.
- Jean Fowler’s parents and family. A marriage contract, testament, or record naming her sister or other relatives could distinguish her from the baptism candidates. Ann Fowler, called an aunt in 1734, is a particularly useful person to trace.
- Evidence identifying Ann Fuller. A contemporary family or legal record could clarify the mother’s names in the 1729 and 1731 entries. The discrepancy should remain open until such evidence is found.
- Robert and Jean’s deaths and estate papers. Look for a spouse, occupation, address, heir, or relative connecting the 1784 burial to this household. The burial entry alone does not make that identification.
- Clara and Sir William’s marriage, and Clara’s death. The parish marriage search has not located their entry. A contract, settlement, family paper, or contemporary notice could supply the date and place; a death notice or burial record could resolve the reported March 1785 date.
- The children’s later lives. Christian, James, Jean, Ann, and Elizabeth remain untraced after baptism. Wills, marriage contracts, business papers, or records naming siblings may be more decisive than a matching name.
- Robert’s merchant career. Burgess, Guildry, apprenticeship, debt, deed, and business records could identify his training, trading partners, property, and heirs.
- The annotation to Thomas’s 1758 baptism. The entry includes wording beginning “Filled up per Order of Sess[ion?]”. A corresponding session record may explain when and why the entry was completed. No date or explanation has yet been established.
Help Us Follow This Family
A family letter, a marriage contract, or a name in an estate inventory could supply the next connection. If you descend from this household or have found a record involving its relatives, we would welcome your contribution.
Share a Record or Family Connection. Please include the source, the names and dates involved, and how the information connects to this family. Uncertain leads are welcome when clearly identified as possibilities.